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RAY COMFORT FELLOWSHIPPING WITH JOYCE MEYER
(Three part bundle at the end, includes False Prophet Reinhard Bonnke who does phony miracles, and false teach Joyce Meyer). So YES! Ray Comfort DOES agree with and allows his material to be packaged with her teaching.
I was asked about what I thought about Ray Comfort appearing on Joyce Meyer’s show. I am afraid some will not appreciate this, but what I do, I do for Him, and for the love of the body, and to obey His Word to “prove all things”.
Can be seen here at this link: http://youtu.be/T9HOrXHK5WY
- Blessed is the man Who walks not in the counsel of the ungodly, Nor stands in the path of sinners, Nor sits in the seat of the scornful. Psalm 1:1
Joyce says at the beginning of part 1, “I always say, God didn’t call us to ‘inreach’ but ‘outreach’.” I agree we should do our part in the great commission, but if Joyce was right, she could have saved the apostles a lot of time on the epistles, and also she evidently has forgotten John 21:15-19 (If you love me, feed my sheep).
People may or may not agree with my thoughts on this. There are a few passages that come to mind regarding associations. So I will share here and see if you come up with the same thoughts I have on the matter.
(For those who follow him, I do not agree with his gospel, being THE Gospel seen in the Word, but just consider this even if you thought he was preaching a true gospel)
Ray Comfort is not at Joyce’s show to debate her. Nor is he there to argue the scriptures with her in the marketplace as far as I could determine. Some will say, “But he is sharing the gospel, isn’t that a good thing?” We will address it I hope. I do not believe this can be compared to a debate with an atheist or a non-believer. So why is he there, and why is he so comfortable with her? (I’ll share later on his Lordship teachings and turn from sin definition of repentance *) Or see here for Ray Comfort’s false gospel which lines up perfectly with Joyce Meyer.
Why? The atheist does not claim to be a “brother or sister in Christ”.
- Rather, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice they sacrifice to demons and not to God, and I do not want you to have fellowship with demons. You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the Lord’s table and of the table of demons. I Cor 10:20-21
Joyce is WOF and also holds to the heretical teaching of Jesus being born again in hell. She is a female pastor (unbiblical also), and is into many of the unbiblical prosperity teachings etc.
So what do I think applies to this situation?
Some may ask, “Could he be there to speak against her error in public?”
Or, “Maybe he is there to help her?”
The question I would rather ask; (Assuming Ray had at one time understood the correct gospel without his addition of ‘turning from sin’) what would his responsibility be?
By his amenable presence on Joyce’s show, he is commending her ministry to those who follow his ministry. Anyone who associates with someone that is a heretical teacher should instantly be suspect in my opinion, especially if they do not publicly disassociate themselves and call out (mark and avoid) false teachings. We don’t judge the world, but others who state they are believers, we do indeed judge their doctrine or we should be worthy to do it. Why is this ‘minister’ unable to discern her heresy?
So, if he understood the right gospel of grace, I think these passages apply. I John 2:9-11 below, seems pretty clear to me- too many try to wrestle with the outcome of what will happen if we obey this passage.
Such as: “How will people view us if we just didn’t talk to them?”
Or, How will non-believers think of Christians or the Lord, if we are “unloving”?
I rather prefer to ask myself
“What will the Lord think of me if I do not obey His Word?”
If I do not defend the gospel? If I do not contend for the faith. How are we then showing our love? Are we tending His sheep? Feeding them what? Poison?
And also I ask this of myself, who am I to decide what the outcome of obeying His Word will be? Who are any of us to compromise what His Word says with “what if’s”?
Even if I haven’t seen it practiced at the churches I have attended, or by pastors, I have to remind myself that we are in the age of apostasy, surrounded by a falling away from the true faith, and obedience to His Word is life. We must obey the truth and God rather than man. These false teachers hinder people from obeying the truth, lead people into eternal death, why on earth would we want to associate in a ministerial capacity with a known wolf?… Beyond me… unless we too are a wolf. Or at the very least disobedient or undiscerniing… My summation knowing Comfort’s own ‘turn from sin’ in order to be saved gospel, is he is clearly accursed by the standards of Gal 1:6-9.
- Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. If ANYONE comes to you and DOES NOT BRING THIS DOCTRINE, do not receive him into your house nor greet him; for he who greets him SHARES in his EVIL DEEDS. 2 John 1:9-11
So Ray pulls out his million dollar bill tract and talks about how everyone receives it with joy, they love it. But is that what 1 Corinthians 1:18 tells us?
For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
STILL NOT CERTAIN?
(If Ray is a believing pastor, then think on the Bride, and who will answer to the Bridegroom for exposing her to ravenous wolves).
- If anyone teaches otherwise and does not consent to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which accords with godliness, he is proud, knowing nothing, but is obsessed with disputes and arguments over words, from which come envy, strife, reviling, evil suspicions, useless wranglings of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself. I Tim 6:3-5
We are to take heed to the doctrine for a reason:
- Take heed to yourself and to the doctrine. Continue in them, for in doing this you will save both yourself and those who hear you. I Tim 4:16
Should we ignore these scriptures and share a pulpit with the false in the hopes of “reaching more people”?
- But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber. 2 Pet 2:1-3
Again, I do not agree with Ray Comfort’s Gospel.
I do not agree with teaching repentance as “stop sinning” or “turn from sin”, or “turn from ALL sin”, “forsake all you sin”, all of which I’ve heard him say. This is law, works, and an accursed gospel.
I reject his Lordship gospel, (totally submitting, stopping sinning, making Jesus Lord of your life). Jesus IS Lord, God has made Him Lord of ALL already. He does not preach Christ and Him crucified, and your need to believe upon Him. They say, if Jesus is not Lord of ALL, He is not your Lord at all. I would venture a guess, that NONE of them have been able to make Him Lord of ALL. But the point is today, not his many subtle errors which most do not notice, but first, why he is associating with a heretic? Because he too is a heretic.
His own teachings may explain his lack of trouble with associating and selling books with Joyce Meyer. And he is getting more and more obvious as the Day grows near. Hopefully he himself will repent (change his mind) and preach the true gospel of Grace.
As we will continue to see men, seemingly sound, compromising the truth, calling men “brethren” who teach a different gospel, quoting men favorably they ought not… It should grieve you instead of excusing him…It blasphemes the way of truth (2 Pet 2) and they are complicit.
MANY will follow their destructive ways.
So you want to lead the sheep over to the wolf in order to get God’s Word out??? Not likely. More likely these men that use this as their excuse, have also long since compromised the gospel for the sake of mammon, fame, a name. Deceived and being deceived.
So before I knew about Ray Comfort’s Lordship teachings, I learned that it is good to pay attention to people who disobey the Scriptures regarding associations with false teachers. Pay attention! Later you will likely find they have their own doctrinal issues OR they will rectify their error. Wolves like to hang out in packs, and sometimes they ‘out’ other wolves in order to elevate themselves to look more like a Sheep. Be discerning! Prove all things! Check what they are saying against the Scriptures, this is a noble thing to do!
- Now I urge you, brethren, note those who cause divisions and offenses, contrary to the doctrine which you learned, and avoid them. For those who are such do not serve our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly, and by smooth words and flattering speech deceive the hearts of the simple. Romans 16:17-19
- But as for you, brethren, do not grow weary in doing good. And if anyone does not obey our word in this epistle, note that person and do not keep company with him, that he may be ashamed. Yet do not count him as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother. 2 Thess 3:13-15
I believe the passage in 2 Thess, gives us the counsel to know what to do for a professing believer who does not obey the Word. Anyone can make a mistake (yes, I’m answering the one that says “nobody’s perfect”.) I’ll let the Word speak. Everyone should obey the truth, and all should tremble at His entire Word. (Is 66:2)
Will we make mistakes? What should we do with those teachers and pastors, apologetics authors, etc. who continue in their disobedience and bad associations? When you bring it to their attention, and they excuse it away, they are guilty and sharing in their evil deeds. Depart from them.
As a matter a fact, what do we do if ANYONE doesn’t obey His Word, or associates with a wolf, and shares in their evil deeds? Don’t keep company with them.
What is our responsibility when we see these things…We can start here…
- For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ. 2 Cor 10:4-5
O.K., let’s get down to the nitty gritty…
What do I think Ray Comfort as a professing believer (assuming his own doctrine was good) should have done when Joyce Meyer asked him to be on her show?
EASY!!! TURN HER DOWN! THAT SIMPLE!
Reject a divisive (heretic) man (or woman) after the first and second admonition, knowing that such a person is warped and sinning, being self-condemned. Titus 3:10-11
Some compare this to a Glenn Beck scenario. I.E. Kirk Cameron being on his secular show. Glenn Beck is not a Christian, he is a Mormon, therefore a Biblical Christian understands he is of the world, and it may to apply. So possibly apples to oranges in someone’s opinion. But, if he calls Beck a Christian, then we have a different problem… Now we know Ray Comfort and Kirk Cameron are teaching a different gospel, and now are Post Trib and teaching that, and they SELL and make money on their gospel. BE ALERT. The enemy is on the prowl.
Because we are told….
- Finding out what is acceptable to the Lord. And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them. Eph 5:10-11
The laying on of hands was done to approve someone for ministry. I know some may not agree with me on this, but isn’t what these pastors/teachers do when they associate together with the heretics? They lead people into error.
- Do not lay hands on anyone hastily, nor share in other people’s sins; keep yourself pure. I Tim 5:22
NOT KEEPING COMPANY WITH THE ONE WHO ASSOCIATES WITH THE WOLF.
Does the verse apply in 2 Thess. 3 to obeying the entire Word? I personally do believe so. The entire epistle of 2 Thessalonians discusses the antichrist, false teachings, and men that are unreasonable and wicked that do not have faith. It reiterates in chapter 3 for believers to do the things that they commanded them. One very important command was that we WITHDRAW from everyone who walks disorderly and NOT ACCORDING to the tradition they received from the apostles (the entire New Testament is written by those who were the apostles or those who traveled with them, or brothers of Jesus. I think this would include the entire Word.)…
We know that we have to obey God’s Word, so for me personally, if someone meets with these people, without the intent of correcting them in public (and that’s even questionable) then I have to stay away from listening to them until they turn from this error.
If you are there to correct them, do it… but don’t compromise His truth.
- And on some have compassion, making a distinction; but others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire, hating even the garment defiled by the flesh. Jude 1:22-23
Besides the greater condemnation teachers will receive for leading someone into error, we have certain standards for the church and a reason for them. It is to protect the flock and to make sure a dying world receives the truth, not poison. Pay attention to who your people are associating with in the name of unity….
Now for those who bring up that Jesus ate with Pharisees, prostitutes and tax collectors, these would be applicable to the standards for the world. We do not judge the world, God judges the world (I Cor 5) but any who profess Christ, it is a different story to associate with some teaching FALSE DOCTRINE.
We are to be commended if we will search the scriptures and hold up someone’s teaching to see if these things are so- Acts 17:11, (Commended! Not to be called heresy hunters, witch hunters, or nit-pickers).
We obey the truth through the Spirit (which purifies our soul), in SINCERE LOVE OF THE BRETHREN… (from I Pet 1).
This is why I think it is so important to not compromise His truth. It is not ours to rationalize what we think might be a better way to handle something. I don’t want to be hanging with one who decides which portions we might obey, and which ones we can let slide in the name of evangelism, unity, love, etc. Because ONLY the truth will set them free… WHY would we want to mingle it with error? It is not error or watered down truth that will set anyone free. It CERTAINLY isn’t false teaching which will save. So again, wolves or compromisers of His truth — either way, Mark and Avoid.
So continue in His Word!
- So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you continue in My Word, then you are truly disciples of Mine; and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” John 8:31-32
A LITTLE LEAVEN
Immorality, especially spiritual fornication, defiles the church. And we have NOT mourned as a church, instead, we invite them to conferences with us, we have them speak at our church, or we go on their t.v. programs.
Each person has to make a decision, it’s not always easy to say in each and every situation. But I believe they are allowing these spiritual fornicators to slip into the church as they have joined hands with their ministries to do certain projects etc.
I believe spiritual fornication is to be treated the same as sexual immorality, it is a sin of rebellion against the truth, fornication against the bridegroom. It is for covetousness, and for their bellies. They revile the real church, and they mock them, and they mock God’s Word and blaspheme the way of truth. Did we forget this passage? Do we not expel the wicked from among us?
- Your glorying is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump? Therefore purge out the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, since you truly are unleavened. For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us. Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner—not even to eat with such a person. For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? But those who are outside God judges. Therefore “put away from yourselves the evil person.” I Corinthians 5:6-8, 11-13
*FOOTNOTE: (FOR ME)
- But what I do, I will also continue to do, that I may cut off the opportunity from those who desire an opportunity to be regarded just as we are in the things of which they boast. For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ. And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works. 2 Corinthians 11:12-15
* For more on Ray Comfort’s errors: (read the comments too)
At the end it offers with Ray Comfort’s offer, Joyce Meyer’s book “The most important decision you’ll ever make…’ (which includes her Jesus died in hell heresy, along with stating if you don’t believe that you can’t be saved.’ It also includes her belief that Jesus gave up His divinity in hell for three days’. Also has false teacher Reinhard Bonnke on part 1 as part of the book package they offer (you can also join his ‘school of fire’ online). Ray says how he studied the “great preacher” methods (Lordship salvation) to see what was missing from our gospel, (and that was the preaching of the law first).
He has some strengths in pointing out sin (but I think his manner is abrasive as he yells as people and suggests the impossible – forsaking sin – it is a WORK and cannot be included in salvation!). Jesus sometimes pointed out their sin, i.e., the woman at the well had five husbands. Did he call her a adulterous, lying, murdering harlot at heart?
Why not ask them if they are loving God with all of their heart, mind, soul and strength, and others as themselves? Why tell a totally depraved sinner (his teaching-Calvinism) totally unable to respond, to “stop sinning“? Isn’t that kind of ludicrous?
Joyce says on the tape, ” I didn’t stop sinning until I finally got it through my thick head I wasn’t a sinner anymore. And the religious world thinks that’s heresy and they want to hang you for it. But the Bible says that I’m righteous and I can’t be righteous and be a sinner at the same time.”
Have you all stopped sinning? Has Ray? Why didn’t he say “What? How did you do that?” (Unless he thinks he has also).
In His “Evidence Bible”, Comfort uses ecumenical and mystical Bill Bright (who joins hand with Roman Catholics, Muslims, and other false teachings in faith summit) for statistics on the video too (only watched the first). He also quotes Bill Bright on this show.
Note: M.H. Reynolds, asked Bright how he could Scripturally justify having Roman Catholics on the Campus Crusade staff, working with them in evangelism (again, having fellowship with the unfruitful deeds of darkness), Bright replied, “I can work with anyone who calls Jesus Lord.” (CIB Bulletin, July 1991, p. 2.) Mormons also call Jesus ‘Lord’.
Ray speaks of he and Kirk Cameron winning the People’s Choice award for several years. What is it? It is Fan favorites in Movies, T.V. and Music. Luke 6:26 comes to mind. Should we expect culture to widely receive us as they are Ray Comfort? Just something to think on.
Copyright © 2012, All Rights Reserved, Holly Garcia